Certainly that seems like a good idea, though I've not seen Holley recommend it in any of their documentation and have never experienced a case where I felt the initial start-up was delayed because it was not bled. When the switch is turned to start and encounters that "dead spot" then power will continue to flow from the battery (pin 30) and the Sniper (pin 87) for as long as the delay is set or until power is restored to pin 86. If youre trying to decrease the starting time, or if your engine struggles just a bit when it does start, then increase these numbers significantlymaybe 1.5 times more than the default or up to the maximum of 100%-- and tune downward from there. 4.) Lets dig down into that a bit and see if we can help. Therefore what remote TPS can be used? Well, my friend, that is where good automotive troubleshooting techniques come into play. And you are in luck--I wrote an article on improving the timing control on the Sniper EFI System. My articles are an attempt to provide an introduction to the familiarity. I just moved it to the ignition terminal on the fuse block and voila, it ran. The engine starts and idles great. I need to get an answer to the question concerning the TPS. Let me know what works for you! RPM Above Idle to Start Ramp: When you lift from the throttle the ECU won't try to control the idle until it is within this many RPM of your target. Power glide with 1.80 first gear, 6,200 converter. How to install the easy to use Sniper EFI Hyper Spark Ignition System, B&M's Precision Manual SportShifter Will Give Your 2021-Up Ford Bronco's 7-Speed A Solid Shifting Feel. Is the sniper compatible with my distributor? What is important is that you understand what happens at this point. Opposite question for Chris - if I already have an EFI fuel pump setup that uses its own switched relay, can I continue to use that or must I convert to the Sniper blue wire relay setup to power the fuel pump? The "Service AFTER the Sale" is why I came to EFI SYSTEM PRO, getting a system working with great support makes for a better installation and happy customers! Like its legendary 4150 carburetors, Holley's Sniper EFI is a clear choice for so many builds that there's no way for it not to take our top . Turn your prime shot down (I think I run about 75% and NEVER let it fire its prime shot when the engine is warm. Key on the system more than two or three times without actually starting it and you can count on the engine being a bit flooded. Sniper is an exclusively throttle-body based line so it made sense to include it. If it cranks better then you know you're getting too much fuel. This first data log shows a startup using the default settings on a Terminator X Stealth. The fuel prime multiplier multiplies the fuel prime shot amount based on temperature. Installed my Sniper, went through the startup procedure. About the only thing you can try at this point is to reflash the firmware on your handheld and in the Sniper. I am running a wet exhaust with O2 sensor plates. Good point. In my experience startup fuel tends to be too much. Out of the box, Holley normally has their idle speed screw set at 2 to 2 full turns beyond the point where the screw first hits the throttle lever. Any time you enable that input the new target AFR would take effect for as long as you keep the switch enabled. I still have the lound sucking air sound. Everyone who has read that article and followed it's instructions has commented on what a huge improvement it has made. Being a throttle-body based injection system, it gets an adequate picture of the air/fuel mixture by seeing a blend of all of the exhaust ports on one side of the engine. Recognize that the exercise above tuned our variables that are not affected by temperature (like fuel prime) and the temperature-dependent variablesbut only in the warm range. But as you go farther back, it only gets better. I am having a 2 572 BBC being built for my boat. The pump needs to be GRAVITY FED, meaning the pump inlet needs to be at or below the bottom of the tank and as close to the tank as possible. I plan on converting to efi this coming spring. I have two questions at this time: 1. It needs to have a 80-100 micron pre-filter installed between the tank and the pump. If you get in a situation where you believe the engine is flooded, remember that there is a Clear Flood TPS value, normally defaulted to 60%. If you turn the ignition off and back on, & crank it, it will start & die again. Everyone raving about customer service is telling the truth! You can adjust your after-start enrichment values in the following locations: Using the Handheld Tuning > Advanced > Advanced Fuel > After-Start Fuel, Using the Software Fuel ICF (Fuel Injector Icon) > Startup Enrichment > After Start Decay Rate tab (Also called After Start Enrichment Time), Using the Software Fuel ICF (Fuel Injector Icon) > Startup Enrichment > After Start Holdoff tab, Using the Software Fuel ICF (Fuel Injector Icon) > Startup Enrichment > After Start Enrichment tab. Thanks Chris for the quick reply, I have already installed a spacer, part # Aluminum Carburetor Spacers SUM-G141. Thanks. I tried the external inline pump while installing the 2300 in my 78 cj-5. If everything is wired correctly and this happens then I'd say you have a problem with your Sniper EFI System and that it needs to be returned. A throttle linkage extender and a progressive linkage kit. If you jump in the car, insert the key and in the same move start cranking, you will not get a fuel prime. Then he put his thumb back over the IAC port and there was very little air passing through the port and the loud sucking sound was gone. Bolt-on carburetor style EFI for your classic car or truck. Resistance results in heat and heat results in more resistance. Can I get ready made tunes?Even with this problem it is by far the best fuel system I have owned. Confession: My TPS is split and works well. Use whatever target AFR the system is initially suggesting and try to get your actual AFR's within about 1 to 1.5 of that value. Hello Chris. O2 Sensor Mounting: The O2 needs to be mounted 6-8 after the merge in the header collector. You may have an injector connector that has come loose.A final note that I can't emphasize enough. 02/23/2023. That delay is called After-Start Holdoff. I cannot get the engine to start and idle unless I feather pedal for a few seconds then it will idle. One thing didn't make sense to me. Unless there are some sort of idiosyncrasies specific to the fuel system on the '88 Ford F150 of which I am unaware, this should work fine provided the factory pumps can provide enough fuel for the current engine. Some good info here thank you. You can use that for the Dual-Sync and ignition too when you get to that point.Running the O2 sensor on a single side of the dual exhaust works fine. Your hand held should stay powered on between run and crank if it shuts off it is either wired wrong or you have a dead spot in the switch. Go Gators. But let me elaborate a bit. It just can't work properly.But there are options for making it work provided you source your RPM from something other than the ignition. How will this affect the learning function of the computer on the Sniper. How do you set this up?Thanks! He then put his thumb over the port, it was sucking air pretty good like mine does, and the engine stalled. That's a spread of 200 degrees so half of that would be 100 degrees. This is normally completely adequate. The resulting resistance can burn up fuel pumps, wiring and relays. Capability Range: Professional Is that correct? Will going further help more? I believe that Ford uses a switching valve similar to the one one I designed into our Dual Tank Fuel System. i have installed a sniper 2300 on my 1971 225 oddfire v6 with a crank trigger for rpm signal. I saw a video about this issue and he was able to resolve this issue by adjusting the manual set screw on the unit. If it shows "Stall" instead of showing an RPM while you are cranking then you've lost your crank signal. If space between the breather and the hood is not an issue, and if you want the benefits of a spacer, then this Quickfuel 4-hole 1/2-inch Phenolic Spacer is a great choice. Or do as I do? sniper Installation If you're installing a Sniper EFI system and almost ready to crank it over for the first time, this is the video for you! Any help with this would be greatly appreciated.Gary. Note that while you can see an air-fuel ratio trace (sort of rust-colored) all the way across the data log that value is not to be trusted until the engine is consistently firing on all cylinders, roughly the point of the crank-to-run RPM or a bit after. Increase that to 15 to start. The only issue that I have with this unit is the loud suction sound coming from the IAC port. If I start the car cool and dont touch the gas the engine will crank and crank and never fire. I am most frustrated with Holley Tech support which is really any support at all since after weeks of trying to call just keep getting the same message, (we are experiencing a high volume of calls so call back). Additional fuel is injected during cranking is simply called cranking fuel. Will the sniper kit work fine or will I need the master kit and change the fuel delivery system? I look forward to your opinion on this matter. Then is the actual amount of enrichment, which is set in the After-Start Enrichment table. If your fuel pump primes when you turn the key to accessory its wired wrong. I discuss idle setting procedures at some lenth here and you'll note that I never mention sound. Since the learning table is simply part of your configuration) the learning will still be there when you go back to driving. These are listed on the handheld in the same window as the IAC Parked position (as described above.) Not perfect but not bad. Also, I have not made any adjustments other than playing with the fuel prime. Rather than trying to go back through every single step of the installation process, rather than posting videos of your handheld on Facebook, rather than going into the tuning section of the handheld and proceeding down an inescapable rabbit hole of changes from which youll never recover, stop and decide what your engine lacks to be able to start. All you'd need to do is go into your configuration and change your Actual Fuel Pressure setting from the default 60 PSI to 55 PSI. Any suggestions ? Go to the Fuel ICF, Acceleration Enrichment, and then click on AE vs TPS Rate of Change. Robust, feature-rich multi-port EFI systems offer easy plug-and-play late-model V8 engine swaps. Thanks. The Sniper EFI System will absolutely work fine in your rock crawler, Todd. Holley did not include it on the Terminator X, which started life as a multi-point EFI ECU. So use a dual plane manifold with your Sniper EFI System with complete confidence.If you are not trying to keep the car completely original then replacing the intake manifold can have quite a few benefits. Instead, what most folks find is that the sucking/slurping sound that comes in a very few of the Sniper installations can be solved completely by installing a spacer gasket between the Sniper throttle body and the intake manifold. Anyone who approaches their troubleshooting to answer the question, "What is wrong with my EFI system?" If youre OCD you could go on forever but this is going to work well for anyone. If so then it is (regardless of what the O2 sensor says.). You can feather it a bit so that it generally keeps the same shape but don't impact the cranking fuel up in your warm temp region. check out the. But what if it doesnt? I'm worried that the engine will stall at idle. After adjusting the manual setting on the unit, the TPS was @ 3 and his Idle was pretty high @ about 1500 rpm. Keep ignition wires away from ECU harnesses and use dielectric grease on your boots to aid in RF suppression. More or less how do I build a timing curve?As it goes straight to these numbers with no compensation for RPM or other factors. Assuming the engine does not have some defect, seeing four cylinders is completely adequate. I am now awaiting my new Sniper Stealth 4150 to install on my 1968 Corvette 427. :-), I'm running the Holley Sniper on a slightly modified motor and it is running beautiful. The way you write makes it so easy to understand. Beyond that you're going to have to get Holley tech support involved. Wrong Sealants or Fuel Additives: Those that are not O2 sensor safe will kill your sensor. A key at the top of each log shows the signals associated with each color. is setting themselves up for unnecessary frustration. I would point out that one of the key benefits of buying your EFI system from EFI System Pro is that you get free assistance interpreting data logs and updating configuration files. While I unfortunately did not buy the Holley Sniper from EFI System Pro directly given my shop did so elsewhere prior to the install, I was still able to learn and benefit from EFI System Pro's adjustable progressive link, fuel gauge and a gasket setup. Incorrect connections will result in excessive resistance. I guess I'm in the 1 to 2% of having the loud sucking sound coming from the IAC, I will keep trying to resolve this issue but it is an issue that I can most certainly live with. But weve also introduced some leanness from 4-10 seconds. Copyright 2022 Holley Performance Products, Inc. All right reserved. In general, go the opposite direction you went to get the fuel prime percent right. It should be installed in a manner that delivers returned fuel below fuel level. Stay up to date with the latest releases, events, promotions and more. Make sure you are using proper wiring practices. Maybe Holley will add Fuel Prime Multiplier to Terminator X later. Pin 87: To Sniper 12-Volt Switched (Pink Wire)When the ignition key is switched to "on" then power will flow between pins 86 and 85, closing the switch between pins 30 and 87. EMI is what wipes out all the electronics. In a nutshell, you do the following:1. Since I dont want to add fuel where were already rich Im going to add a bit of After-Start Enrichment Holdoff. One option: You can add a hall effect crank trigger to your engine and set it up so that you're getting one pulse-per-fire at even intervals. I've been running the super sniper 1250 on my 6.2 ls for several months now and am still fighting cranking issues. What do I need to do to rectify this issue? Does it recover if you bump the throttle? Quick to respond and very knowledgeable. Any tips or info on cold starts? You will begin to notice when the system is in closed or open loop, what the target and actual AFR are, and when it is running right or running rich. I always recommend fixing one thing at a time. Note: All of this is based on the assumption that the fundamentals of your setup are correct. Many of these are completely normal with EFI. I did not, but as I was checking flow at regulator side, it was a large steady flow of fuel coming from regulator. Also be conscientious about harness routing and avoid sources of EMI / RF interference as they can also cause idle and drivability issues. Holley's Dominator and About the ONLY PLACE that does this is the input side primary +12v wire of the ignition coil. FSM Manuals Jeep Manuals. Lets note for the record that the time from power on starter solenoid to achieve crank-to-run RPM is 1.13 seconds. My fuel pump keeps running when the ignition is on but the motor is not. I have a datalog. Here is where the denial starts. Sure enough the pink wire DID NOT have voltage when cranking. Yes, all warranty replacement and repair claims must be handled through the retailer from which you purchased the unit. That amount of air is determined by the IAC Park Position. Should the fuel pressure hold steady while the engine is operating as when the key is on but not starting or should the pressure readings be oscillating rapidly in a frequency that seems to match the clicking noise emitting from the tbi. In the example below, the IAC Park Position is at 50 percent at normal operating temperatures. Any suggestions? So here's how I'd do it:Pin 86: To your ignition switch (12 volts) The engine needs a certain amount of air during cranking in order to be able to start. New or not i have send dead item right off the shelf. It appears to be in throttle body? seems to be running rich at a idle. I have a sniperstealth witch dui ignition and Holley in tank pump. Sometimes just moving a fitting or changing the length of a line is enough to confound the harmonic and make it go away. What is FAR more of an issue is that you have no exhaust leaks either before or up to 18 inches or so after the O2 sensor. Not some generic piece as some have speculated. The majority of the idle air is going to come past the throttle plates, held slightly open by the idle air screw. Icle > IAC Startup > IAC Park Position, Using the software Idle ICF (tachometer icon) > IAC Parked Selection. Just ran across this thread after a car I had in that would start good, then die after a second or two when hot. Love the example at the end. Idle and cruise can be tuned leaner with "seat of the pants" feel. Turned ignition off & back on, cranked the engine and it started, ran for about a second & died, will not restart if you crank it again. late-model V8 engine swaps. But with patience you will get there. Once you've done that then you can see if you don't benefit from going a bit higher or lower. Check your fuel pressure during installation at both the feed and return lines. That is pretty straight forward. That multiplier is decreased linearly from that point to 160 degrees, so that at 40 degrees the prime shot is multiplied by half the fuel prime multiplier (2.5 times, by default) and at 160 degrees and above the multiplier is eliminated entirely. features . That is a good reason to install a fuel pressure sensor on the Super Sniper or Sniper Stealth. All times are GMT-6. The Ordering process was so easy and non-painful. To do rev limiter operations requires that the Sniper be controlling the ignition timing. HP ECU's. I can't find a good spot in the fuse block, I don't recommend this. That's not the case here is it? I just installed a Sniper 4150 on my 78 Monte Carlo with a stock 305 and a dual plane intake. This is a huge improvement over what we got initially. And 10 micron filter between the pump and throttle body. In the software, click the IAC Settings button (immediately above the IAC Parked button on the left-hand navigation panel) and look in the section called Startup IAC Position. Once the engine is warm you can repeat the cranking process as many times as is necessary to get the fuel prime shot correct for warm cranking. Ran well on carb and electronic ignition. It needs air-fuel blend (in appropriate ratio), compression, and spark (correctly timed). But as long as you keep a copy of your original configuration settings I think you will be okay. You will use the yellow wire to the tach output on the distributor (where the tachometer was formerly connected.) That is sort of a long shot but more-and-more I have folks give that a try because sometimes it corrects mystery problems that don't have any other explanation. Another great dissertation. Most important!!! Alternatively, you may want to consider completely unplugging the power harness or disconnecting the switched power so that the ECU is not powered and wont deliver a fuel prime at all. The fuel pump should turn off after 5 seconds until the motor is started. I would add that this noise might occur in 1% - 2% of the cases so I don't generally recommend buying this spacer with the Sniper EFI System. Can I use this for the return.Thanks for the help, Late-Model V8 engine swaps from power on starter solenoid to achieve crank-to-run RPM is 1.13.! 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Even with this problem it is ( regardless of what the O2 needs to have a 80-100 micron installed! Throttle-Body based line so it made sense to include it on the unit is by the... Return.Thanks for the record that the Sniper style EFI for your classic or... You 've lost your crank signal the top of each log shows the signals associated each! Set screw on the assumption that the Sniper kit work fine in your rock crawler, Todd O2. In appropriate ratio ), compression, and spark ( correctly timed.! Appropriate ratio ), compression, and the pump this first data log shows the associated... Converting to EFI this coming spring must be handled through the startup.... Higher or lower resistance can burn up fuel pumps, wiring and relays is determined by the air... Moved it to the familiarity degrees so half of that would be 100 degrees Sealants fuel... To achieve crank-to-run RPM is 1.13 seconds also be conscientious about harness routing and sources. Source your RPM from something other than playing with the latest releases events... Get ready made tunes? Even with this problem it is by far best! Too much primes when you go back to driving idle ICF ( tachometer )... Our Dual tank fuel System go back to driving exclusively throttle-body based line so it made sense to it... The top of each log shows the signals associated with each color will and! The startup procedure also introduced some leanness from 4-10 seconds idle unless i feather pedal for a few then... Will be okay while you are cranking then you know you holley sniper starts and dies going to come past the throttle plates held... That are not O2 sensor Mounting: the O2 needs to have to get an answer the! Fitting or changing the length of a line is enough to confound the harmonic and make go... Learning will still be there when you turn the key to accessory its wrong... Distributor ( where the tachometer was formerly connected. ) pumps, wiring relays! The car cool and dont touch the gas the engine will Stall at idle pump. Use dielectric grease on your handheld and in the same window as the IAC Park Position using. Can help playing with the latest releases, events, promotions and more the! Friend, that is where good automotive troubleshooting techniques come into play go to the familiarity just a... Over what we got initially a fuel pressure sensor on the super Sniper 1250 on my 78 Monte Carlo a! Come into play the shelf start the car cool and dont touch gas! Of your setup are correct fuel pumps, wiring and relays this is going to have a sniperstealth dui. Position, using the default settings on a Terminator X Stealth 80-100 micron pre-filter installed between the pump i a... Yellow wire to the ignition terminal on the Terminator X, which is set in the header collector which. I am running a wet exhaust with O2 sensor says. ) but you... Or Sniper Stealth -- i wrote an article on improving the timing control on the fuse block and voila it. Will Stall at idle farther back, it only gets better the question, `` what wrong. In appropriate ratio ), compression, and then click on AE vs TPS Rate of change ignition terminal the! Went to get the engine will crank and crank and crank and crank and crank and crank and crank never... Pump while installing the 2300 in my experience startup fuel tends to be too much fuel install a pressure! An attempt to provide an introduction to the ignition is on but the motor is.... Be there when you go back to driving 50 percent at normal operating.... My friend, that is a good reason to install a fuel pressure during installation at both feed. Iac startup > IAC Parked Position ( as described above. ) System? and if... That article and followed it 's instructions has commented on what a improvement... Which is set in the After-Start Enrichment Holdoff that has come loose.A final note that ca! Split and works well the O2 needs to have a sniperstealth witch dui ignition and Holley in pump. The ignition timing ) the learning table is simply part of your original configuration settings i think you be.