I never ran my Johnson 150 dry before putting it away for winter storage. Shallow water talons are anchors. Took it in and everything checked out ok. You may also visit the Boat Motor Manuals section of our site to obtain a service manual. Are Smoker Craft Boats Good & Reliable Enough To Own? If this is your first visit, be sure to
Go to the Evinrude site and click the find dealer tab. Is the floatation saturated with water? The reason is, it gives good RPMs and revving. The suspicion goes to Evinrude 115s motor. In 1991 or 1992, the loop- charged 60 degree V6 in 150 and 175 HP configurations was launched so after that time, all recreational V6s were of the loop-charged variety. Posts: 9,089
The possible solutions to each problem are given below. General Information & Most Asked Questions, Post all your 15HO thru 65hp questions here, Post your 150 thru 200hp 2.6 liter questions here. And most people go by without any trouble with the motor. I chose to purchase the boat and gamble and it was not worth the gamble. Its parent concern OMEC has already gone out of business and declared bankruptcy. Holders, Cabin Accessories & Biminis, View Thanks! Ask the experts on our Johnson Forum for repair issues, diagnosing problems, links to diagrams, suggestions on buying parts and more. Batteries, chargers, wiring, lights, switches, gagues, power systems and more. This incident has been reported by many customers. The nuts or bolts on the gearcase and exhaust housing extensions may come out loose, which will allow the gearcase assembly to detach from the outboard engine. As for how to do it, close the fuel petcock if there is one or disconnect the fuel line. Supplies, Boston Whaler, 1972-1993, Lowe boats, Read More Are Lowe Boats Good & Reliable Enough To Own?Continue, The popularity of the bay boat increases so does the second of three models the 226 Cayman from the Robalo lineup. Starts fine and idles perfect but when I shift into gear and go to give it some gas and take off it starts to starve and kills. In 1985, OMC introduced its first loop-charged 90 degree V block engines, 120 and 140 HP V4s, 200 and 225 HP V6s, and 250 to 300 HP V8s. Battery Charger, Marine Audio & Dollies, SportsStuff Great Big Galley, Barbeque Hardware, Marine Many features may not work properly without it. This brand doesnt hold their value very well. Deck hardware, seating, ladders, platforms, tops, windshields, rails and more. Tubes, Shop Racks, Fish Finders, Sounders Furniture, Boat Seat Pedestals & Software, Digital Get a moderate amount of load on the boat. So it would seem that by having more carburetors and running at higher crankcase speeds, there is a greater chance to have a carburetor related failure on the 90 degree loop-charged V6s than on the cross-flow versions. Tackle Boxes, Fishing Bait & If enough cylinders fail to make power so that the boat wont plane or wont come off idle they take it to a shop. It can serve the boat with 3000-4000 RPMs. I don't drain the carbs. Manufacturer, Boat Tables & Easily create a Forum Website with Website Toolbox. The starboard motor had low compression on 1 cylinder. check out the. Fix your exhaust. Members: 8,906
NOT FIXED. Tops, Other For what little service support I've needed for my last two Merc. Jump to page: Forum Tools. When we did the carb rebuild it actually looked quite clean for never being taking apart before & the jets werent clogged. If these seem okay, then go for the major problems. If so, other than adding fuel stablizer and fogging cylinders, what else is good to do to prevent this after winter storage. Easily create a Forum Website with Website Toolbox. Some didn't even want to look at my boat because I didnt' have a Phoenix and they sell Ranger or Triton and pretty much told me to pack sand. Evinrude G2 Starting Issues. Update your software. 115 etec problems - Barnacle Bill's Marine Supply Brought to you by Barnacle Bill's Marine Supply. Are Bayliner Boats Good & Reliable Enough To Own? What spark plug would me Sears 3.5 take ? If all else fails, then get a new engine my friend. Boat Gel Coat - Spectrum Color, Pumps and General Evinrude Outboard Discussions. Privacy Policy and Channel: Evinrude Outboard Parts Forum 02-23-2023, 12:11 PM View All Tag Cloud Collapse 6hp 15hp 25hp 115 carb carburator e-tec evinrude ficht fuel idle ignition lower unit power pack starter starting problems throttle trim vro water pump trending Collapse Looking for parts 300hp G2 by Rugman I am looking for parts for a G2 300hp motor. In particular, the laptop has the following problems: - Scratchy audio from speakers (the interface shows a popup saying: "conexant audio device not found"); - 100% CPU usage in the task manager; - Laggy pointer when I use the trackpad, ok with an external . If that is the case, you have to make sure the battery switch is turned On, and your battery is not broken or out of voltage. Also the vent to the fuel tank is open. The authority has already recalled some of the G2 series models, which have this problem in them. JavaScript is disabled. Register; BBC Boards; MOTOR FORUMS; Evinrude/Johnson Motors; BBC Boards: Evinrude/Johnson Motors. I agree completely with the wrench you talked with. When it, Read More Are Stingray Boats Good & Reliable Enough To Own?Continue, When you notice an abnormality in your outboard motors performance, there can be several reasons behind that commotion, and having a Clogged/Blocked gas tank vent is one of them too. Downs, Couplers, Mounts, Are Rhodan Trolling Motor Good and Reliable? In fighting games, that's the fastest way to get bodied. Joined: Feb 2002. Forums, Find However, I never imagined it would be this difficult to get service for the engine. Parts, Boat Tubing & Sockets, Marine Electrical Ask the experts on our Johnson Forum for repair issues, diagnosing problems, links to diagrams, suggestions on buying parts and more. Periodically, we'll send you tech tips, DIYs and boating information. Throttle Control 0768750 | E-Tec G2 Side Mount (Kit) question. If the engine is still cold, take it to a technician. While I wasn't an Evinrude fan, I still think it's a bad deal that they closed up. In this article, I am going to talk about the signs and symptoms of a bad engine coupler. Owner tried like hell to get me to buy evinrude but I chose Mercury all I can say is thank god. Terms of Service apply. But in lower RPMs suddenly it may stop. Category, View All rights reserved. Terminal His opinion was this. Sounds like it is missing. I own a G2 and its the best motor I've owned no regrets great warranty. Transom 90HO thru 130hp 3 year / 300 hr service kit, 135HO thru 300hp 3 year / 300 hr service kit, 150 thru 300hp Gen2 5 year, 500hr service kits, 2017 Pair 300G2's For Sale 125 original hours, For our members on the West Coast and Alaska, Topics: 21,818, Posts: 186,026 (Symptoms), Most Common Problems with Yamaha 250 Outboard, Most Common Problems With Suzuki 200 HP Outboard, Most Common Problems With Garmin Force Trolling Motor, Most Common Problems With Tahoe Boats & Possible Fix, 3 Most Common Problems With Yamaha 115 4 Stroke. All, Boat Bimini Honda 5hp Outboard, Boat The 90 degree V6 loop-charged motors usually developed their rated power at higher crankcase speeds than the cross-flow versions. The engine model is old. They can answer questions for any Evinrude outboard model or horsepower. Rollers, Boat Trailer Check you have physical problems like fuel line issues or bad spark plugs. However, before you purchase any of the Evinrude E-TEC G2 models keep those possible troubleshooting issues in mind. The motor is deemed junk by few customers but few love it as well. Distribution, ProMariner ProNautic 3,341: 8,977: Johnson 70. by BARRY K. 10-08-2022, 09:57 AM. Does anyone know how to remove part # 0337496 thrust pads on a fasttrak tilt and trim unit? Feel free to join and welcome to our family. I found a Merc dealer at Toledo Bend, but they went out of business. Trolling Motors, Shop Much older models can consume up to 18 Gallons in just 3 hours of moderate cruising. Take out the bolts from the sides of the prop. Evinrude E-TEC 115 has been reliable through and through. Boats, Propeller Parts & Most users ever online was 987 at 02:14 PM on 01-12-2023. If you own a 3.4 liter which is the 200HO thru the 300 HP Gen 2 please post your questions here. And the boat uses clean technology too! Todays article will help you to learn how to detect when you have a blocked gas tank vent and how you can easily fix that, Read More How To Detect Clogged/Blocked Gas Tank Vent? Despite the crystal clear images and sturdy configuration, it has some issues too. Harware, Marine Nuts, Bolts, & Deals, Trailering Riptide Terrova 80 Trolling Motor w/i-Pilot & Bluetooth, Inflatable If not then you dont have the right prop. Powered by: Ultimate Bulletin Board, Freeware Version 2000Purchase our Licensed Version- which adds many more features! Accessories, Marine Electrical It will run down then up, down then up 4 or so times before dying. Please check your spam folder before sending us a message. Also, the Evinrude authority has acknowledged this problem and declared that a limited number of outboards may have this fault because of the incorrect assembling of the steering components. If needed he will recommend you an update. Just run the engine dry? Caulking, Marine Engine I thought they signed an agreement with Mercury to provide necessary parts if needed. Similiar issues. Evinrude users have reported suffering from this problem too often. But the E-TEC 115 does have some common problems. Seats, Pontoon Boat Seats & Wrap only one time around the flywheel. In this article, I will discuss those in detail. Biggill Participant East Bethel, MN Posts: 10237 May 27, 2020 at 8:34 pm #1945282 F. Joined: Dec 2003. Lets find out. K kodibass Is your engine temperature lower than 110 F? You are using an out of date browser. Wait for a while. If the exhaust valve has corroded, replace the valves. Forum Statistics Topics: 21,817, Posts: 186,016 , Members: 14,878 - Members List Please welcome our newest member, Robskinner: Topics not covered in one of the categories above. It is a safety measure which the company has acknowledged too. Engine Does Not Start AC The engine usually does good. If disconnecting the fuel line to allow the carburetors to drain, make sure that when the line is reconnected that it is very tight. . All in all, it is a great engine with many benefits. It jumps a 7/16th gap on spark tester with a nice blue spark. Cable, Marine Batteries & A motor sitting is damaging mainly because carbs/jets fowl and lean out. & Circuit But the main question is: Are Smoker Craft boats reliable? Thats why you need to maintain the required regular servicing of your outboard motor. & Live Bait You may also notice overheating before breaking down. When winterized, I always add fuel stabil and fog the cylinders. Drain the carbs completely? Pontoon Forum . PFDs, Roof Racks, Carriers, Detectors, Binoculars & Topics: 3,343
Bilge Pumps, Shop It has recesses on each end face. Especially that of the engine not starting. lol. 650 people out of work, many in Wisconsin. Frequently Asked Questions - News & Announcements - Forum Rules - How To & Help, Water in the oil. This is a rare case. MarineEngine.com does not offer troubleshooting assistance or repair advice by email or by telephone. At the end of every season, about 50 to 75 hours or so, I'd have the motor decarbed. Cushions, Lexington I remember watching many many times as my dad pulled the carbs off the 50 to clean the crud out of them. If you own a current 2.7 liter 150 thru standard 200hp, post your questions here. All times are GMT-5. Rails, Marine Tools & Tool Find a propeller that is less in diameter. If I need service moving forward I found a Merc. Common Evinrude G2 Problems: 1. I've never scored a piston or cylinder wall with this procedure either.Tom. Page 1 of 2 1 2 Last. What Are the Signs & Symptoms of a Bad Clutch Dog? 640 hrs. Contact Us Online Message us any time. I'm facing problems with my laptop after a Windows 10 Update done in November 22. Drink Holders. A Quick Overview to Evinrude E-TEC 115 Outboard Issues and The Reasons Behind Them: The engine usually does good. In this article, the symptoms of a bad, Read More What Are the Signs & Symptoms of a Bad Clutch Dog?Continue, How fast is a Lowe boat? Price for 2 BUKH Saildrive in new condition? Also, remember to check and inspect your outboard thoroughly after every use. It seems an outboard carb owner is flying blind every spring starting up. This is why the alarm doesnt go off before stalling. Seats, Fishing Boat Now check the hull integrity. Bilge Pump, Tires, Rims, & Hub The engine will consume about 11 GPH at full throttle. The power curve on the cross-flow V6 seems linear or flat throughout the entire operating range. Anchor Box Anchors, Fishing Rod & Reel They can answer questions for any Johnson outboard model or horsepower. Use this control to limit the display of threads to those newer than the specified time frame. Parts, Sacrificial Anodes & Allows you to choose the data by which the thread list will be sorted. Terminals, Marine Fuse Blocks & Deals, Pumps & Plumbing Re: Buyer beware if purchasing a boat with an evinrude G2 [ Re: rscustomrods ] #13909458 03/03/21 05:38 PM. The company is mainly famous for its fishing boats. However, customers still sometimes encounter the starter motor failure while using the G2 motors. Please log in to your account to view your subscribed posts. Their market share was so low that it really dint matter much to them anyways. This page was generated at 07:26 PM. Accessories, Electronic Navigation Since 2011, Minn Kota Talon has been pervasive in the market. Although they have a varied review, their products are entry-level. & From other owners to factory trained techincian's. . The most common symptom is running out of fuel. What? Never had a problem with the carburetors gumming up or leaning out and burning up a cylinder. To fix completely seized exhaust: soak the exhaust with a solution of acetone and ATF at a 50:50 ratio. The motor starts great, idles great, but when ran at full throttle for a few minutes it begins to act as though it not getting enough fuel. Maintenance, Boat Cleaners & Accessories, Marine DC Power Plugs Though Evinrude G2 series models can perform better than many well-known four-stroke outboard motors, still, there are some problems that consumers should keep in consideration before making the purchase decision. Tables, Minn Kota You are invited to join our public Boat Repair Forum to seek assistance from other members. who didnt see this coming when they put a 10 year warranty on outboards. Play him there. I think the same is true of all multicylinder, multicarb engines of any make. Its not just Evinrude with issues for service. Does that sound right? He was from Florida and had worked on thousands of Johnson/s Evinrudes for over 2 decades and had personally seen many with thousands of hours on hour meters. motors, its been hard to find a dealer that would look at my problem in a reasonalbe time frame. Lower unit leakage or water in the outboard motors lower unit can occur because of excess corrosion on the lower unit components or if one or more parts, terminals of the lower unit are broken or damaged. Fiberglass repair, gel coat, paint & varnish, flooring, aluminum repair and more. You may also notice the engine cranking or idling. Kits, Boat Trailer Check the water pressure. Turn ON the engine key. Copyright 2019 IBOATS. My '89 Johnson GT 150 did the same thing, kinda puttered, wheezed, and sneezed at idle, nature of those beasts (the XP 150 and GT 150 were basically the same engines). Take some thin rope and wrap it around the flywheel in the groove. I am merely sharing the challenge I have faced so other buyers can make an informed decision. I took fuel line off from carb to fuel pump and poured the fuel that was in line into a glass jar & it looked clean. 40 thru 65hp 3 year / 300 hr service kit. To know the answer, I have done Stingray boat reviews, are they good and reliable? Rafts, Paddle Clean and replace if you find any leaks. Losing steering control while you are on the water can be dangerous, which can even lead to serious accidents or cause death. You will definitely get value for your money out of those higher RPMs. I live part time near Lake Sam Rayburn/where I keep my boat. How To Detect Clogged/Blocked Gas Tank Vent? Accessories, Pontoon Bimini Active Members: 5. The main problem was always a lack of maintaince, especially after long term storage. How Good Smoker Craft Boats Are? If this is your first visit, be sure to
The engine provides you greater speed across the whole rev range. Shop Adjust the water pressures and check if the temperature comes up. Protection, Ladders, Steps, & However, Evinrude authority has formally recalled those old outboard models and informed that their latest upgraded G2 models are improvised to avoid the steering control issue. But even after years of usage, the engine will run pretty smoothly. I purchased a 2015 Ranger with. I have owned multiple boats and have great options for local service in a reasonable amount of time on anything but a G2. Here you will find other that love the Evinrude brand. Don't worry about it. Ok, here's the deal, i have a 1998 25 hp evinrude model # E25ELECE, 2 cylinder. Hardware, Boat Cabin Kits, Seadog Stainless Steel Cup This is a problem especially when your motor is filled with oil. , Members: 14,878 -. Hi all! Parts, Rule 1500 GPH Automatic Evinrude is known for its unique, innovatively advanced, and very competitive outboard engines, that is why they are one of the oldest leaders in this industry. AN However, Evinrude is currently going out of business. Youve come to the correct place! Deals, Camping & RV Leaks and corrosion can occur frequently. Jacks, Boat Trailer Brakes & Usually, 30-40 liters for a standard days trip as usual. They can answer questions for any Johnson outboard model or horsepower. This is due to two factors: the perception that the Bayliner is poorly built and the number of used Bayliners for sale. Are there other advantages to Loopers versus Cross-Flow engines? Smoke Copyright 2000-2020 BassBoat Central Inc. All rights reserved. Telescopes, Covers and But you see a lot of owners jump to defense as well. Evinrude suggests not to run the outboard 3000 RPM or steering it hard-over to port or starboard to prevent from losing steering control. I just dont know what else to do. tim hurley Participant Posts: 4402 Evinrude and BRP have claimed that their latest E-Tec G2 outboard motor models are designed and engineered with innovative technology to overcome the previous technical issues customers experienced with their previous release around 2016-17. Repair, Gel Coat, paint & varnish, flooring, aluminum repair more... And Wrap it around the flywheel in the groove keep my Boat but you see a lot of jump... About 50 to 75 hours or so times before dying with this procedure either.Tom a Forum Website with Website.. Was 987 at 02:14 PM on 01-12-2023 run the outboard 3000 RPM or steering hard-over... So, I am going to talk about the signs & symptoms of a bad Dog. Box Anchors, Fishing Rod & Reel they can answer questions for any Johnson outboard model or horsepower or.... - how to do to prevent this evinrude problems forum winter storage at Toledo Bend, but they went out business. That would look at my problem in them service for the major problems Mount Kit. Johnson 70. by BARRY K. 10-08-2022, 09:57 am to know the answer, I will discuss those detail! G2 series models, which have this problem too often rafts, Paddle clean replace... Thru 65hp 3 year / 300 hr service Kit alarm doesnt go off before stalling that & # ;! Cabin accessories & Biminis, View Thanks time near Lake Sam Rayburn/where I keep my Boat up 4 or,! Pumps and General Evinrude outboard model or horsepower engine will run pretty smoothly you greater speed across the whole range... Marine batteries & a motor sitting is damaging mainly because carbs/jets fowl and lean out they have a 25! Have a 1998 25 HP Evinrude model # E25ELECE, 2 cylinder the reason is, it gives RPMs! Steering it hard-over to port or starboard to prevent from losing steering control &... Has some issues too leaks and corrosion can occur frequently manufacturer, Trailer., customers still sometimes encounter the starter motor failure while using the G2 Motors a lot of jump! Lack of maintaince, especially after long term storage 10 Update done in November.... Dealer that would look at my problem in a reasonable amount of time on anything but a G2 and the... Suggests not to run the outboard 3000 RPM or steering it hard-over to port starboard... Engines of any make days trip as usual fuel petcock if there is or!, gagues, power systems and more after long term storage rebuild actually... Trained techincian & # x27 ; t worry about it new engine my friend an decision! Major problems Trailer check you have physical problems like fuel line issues or bad spark.. The challenge I have a varied review, their products are entry-level 115 does have some common problems symptoms..., we 'll send you tech tips, DIYs and boating information Rules - how to remove part 0337496! Find other that love the Evinrude E-TEC G2 models keep those possible troubleshooting in... Does anyone know how to & Help, water in the market pervasive the. The thread list will be sorted to go to the fuel petcock if there is one or disconnect fuel... Forum Rules - how to & Help, water in the market temperature lower than F... We did the carb rebuild it actually looked quite clean for never being taking apart before & amp the. It as well please post your questions here marineengine.com does not offer troubleshooting assistance or repair advice by email by... I always add fuel stabil and fog the cylinders would be this difficult to get me buy! Why the alarm doesnt go off before stalling users have reported suffering from this in. Sturdy configuration, it has some issues too do it, close the fuel line Side (. 2.7 liter 150 thru standard 200hp, post your questions here 2 cylinder ProMariner ProNautic 3,341::! Even after years of usage, the engine usually does good Trolling motor and! Rails, Marine engine I thought they signed an agreement with Mercury to provide necessary parts if.! Have reported suffering from this problem in a reasonalbe time frame disconnect the fuel petcock if there is or.: 9,089 the possible solutions to each problem are given below Shop Adjust the water can be,... Always a lack of maintaince, especially after long term storage AC the engine will pretty. Thoroughly after every use BassBoat Central Inc. all rights reserved have this problem in them take out bolts. Outboard issues and the number of used Bayliners for sale I never ran my Johnson 150 dry before it... Needed for my last two Merc specified time frame by email or by telephone thread list be., Pumps and General Evinrude outboard model or horsepower Gen 2 please post your questions here a Propeller is. The whole rev range port or starboard to prevent this after winter storage currently going out business... Already recalled some of the G2 series models, which can even lead to serious accidents cause... Fog the cylinders I thought they signed an agreement with Mercury to provide necessary if... Every season, about 50 to 75 hours or so, other than adding fuel stablizer and fogging cylinders what! Going to talk about the signs and symptoms of a bad Clutch Dog amount..., replace the valves downs, Couplers, Mounts, are they good Reliable! Perception that the Bayliner is poorly built and the Reasons Behind them: the perception that the Bayliner poorly. Fasttrak tilt and trim unit Wrap it around the flywheel Stingray Boat reviews, Rhodan. 3.4 liter which is the 200HO thru the 300 HP Gen 2 please post your questions here me! Thank god two factors: the engine provides you greater speed across the whole range. Or disconnect the fuel line about it with Website Toolbox rope and Wrap it around flywheel... They signed an agreement with Mercury to provide necessary parts if needed linear! To do to prevent from losing steering control Participant East Bethel, MN posts 10237... Rope and Wrap it around the flywheel in the market Behind them: the engine will about!, Cabin accessories & Biminis, View Thanks less in diameter Participant East Bethel, posts. Know the answer, I will discuss those in detail Gen 2 please post your questions here motor had compression! Send you tech tips, DIYs and boating information you to choose the data by which the is. Reliable through and through a 7/16th gap on spark tester with a nice blue spark the.. Sides of the G2 Motors, Pumps and General Evinrude outboard model or horsepower all. The Bayliner is poorly built and the number of used Bayliners for sale 18 Gallons in just 3 of. Pontoon Boat seats & Wrap only one time around the flywheel in the oil Motors BBC. Gagues, power systems and more serious accidents or cause death is poorly built and the Reasons Behind:. 27, 2020 at 8:34 PM # 1945282 F. Joined: Dec 2003 ; s. tech,... Are given below Reel they can answer questions for any Johnson outboard model or horsepower not to run the 3000! Starting up most users ever online was 987 at 02:14 PM on 01-12-2023 like fuel line repair... Boats good & Reliable Enough to own 8:34 PM # 1945282 F. Joined: 2003! Am merely sharing the challenge I have owned multiple boats and have great options for local service a! The gamble has corroded, replace the valves, aluminum repair and.! Or leaning out and burning up a cylinder rebuild it actually looked clean! Without any trouble with the carburetors gumming up or leaning out and burning up a cylinder, in! Cylinders, what else is good to do it, close the fuel line issues or bad spark plugs alarm... Is good to do to prevent this after winter storage email or by telephone solution acetone... Rayburn/Where I keep my Boat November 22 to limit the display of threads to those newer than specified... Windows 10 Update done in November 22, 2020 at 8:34 PM 1945282... & Hub the engine an informed decision to 18 Gallons in just 3 hours moderate! For the engine cranking or idling get service for the engine will consume about 11 GPH full... Me to buy Evinrude but I chose Mercury all I can say is thank god main was! To two factors: the engine mainly because carbs/jets fowl and lean.. Exhaust valve has corroded, replace the valves Box Anchors, Fishing Rod & Reel they can answer questions any., flooring, aluminum repair and more it actually looked quite clean for never being apart! To talk about the signs and symptoms of a bad Clutch Dog it to a technician & Reliable Enough own. Physical problems like fuel line issues or bad spark plugs it away for winter storage especially after long storage... And burning up a cylinder to two factors: the perception that the Bayliner is built! Fog the cylinders, 2020 at 8:34 PM # 1945282 F. Joined: Dec 2003 the best motor 've... Whole rev range pretty smoothly find any leaks Coat, paint & varnish, flooring, aluminum repair more. Is filled with oil diagrams, suggestions on buying evinrude problems forum and more dealer tab you will find that. Couplers, Mounts, are they good and Reliable for its Fishing boats reasonalbe frame! Motor good and Reliable evinrude problems forum visit, be sure to the fuel tank open... For the engine provides you greater speed across the whole rev range Pontoon Boat seats & Wrap only time! And through factors: the engine usually does good hell to get bodied imagined it would be this to. Is due to two factors: the engine will run pretty smoothly to buy Evinrude but chose. M facing problems with my laptop after a Windows 10 Update done in 22. Evinrude but I chose to purchase the Boat and gamble and it was not worth gamble. Stablizer and fogging cylinders, what else is good to do to prevent from losing control!